What is going on ? The market is up, car sales are not as bad as expected, but we are down again.
SIRIUS XM SATELLITE RADIO FORUM
What is going on ? The market is up, car sales are not as bad as expected, but we are down again.
I'm new to this, and I'm not day trading. I hold 250,000 shares of SIRI and I'm holding for the hopeful run up. But, what's not clear to me is the concept of manipulation you are all talking about. Can someone explain please? How can MMs prevent a bonafide order either way (sell or buy)? If the order doesn't get filled, that would result in one pissed off customer. So, if I put in a buy order of 500,000 shares with a limit of .36, and the stock is at .35, how do MMs block me from buying the stock at .35 or .36? And, to anyone who might be so kind as to explain, please use everyday language and not abbreviations and day trade lingo, cause it's hard to follow for those of us who don't have the experience. Thanks!
Your scenario is exactly what happened. Lets say you have a 500k buy order at .35 and I have a 500k sell order at .36. The MM's see this and trade in front of it. They will block your .35 order with bids such as .3520 and will block my order with offers of .3580.Originally Posted by underway
underway, you are not alone my friend, I am close to give up to understand anything regarding this stock.
Thanks Brandon. I see. Ok, but now I as the buyer, would be pissed off and go after my broker for not filling my order at .35. I guess I'm saying I don't see how they can get away with that for long. I suppose when volume's low, they can do it. But if there's real solid buying demand, I don't see how they can get away with it. Also, what if I have a buy at .35, and you have a sell at .35, how can they manipulate that transaction?
They can't. It would automatically be executed. I have news for you on the pissed thing. CINN exchange had about 50,000 shares for sale all day at .35. They were stepped on by IGES all day. CINN could lodge a complaint themselves.
In reference to Brandon's example...I see how the MM keeps the trade from going through however why would they want to keep a sp stationary. It seems to me no one makes money in that situation.
^ sell for lower in hopes that others will follow suit and drive the price down a bit.....maybe? i don't know im in the same boat as you underway, still trying to figure out how this changes anything.......
i was thinking they either slowly sell incrementally up in small chunks so others get on the band wagon and buy, then they sell......or they slowly sell down in increments and buy with larger chunks when it goes lower......i think it only works when there is a gap between the bid and ask tho right?
Same question here. I thought MM's made money with activity. Why not let the market establish the price then step in there. I've learned so much reading in this forum but this concept still baffles me.
That takes a little bit of reasoning. It is clear that the stock price has been "walked" down in recent days. With OEM data coming out and a poor quarter expected, many of these big hedge funds would have shorted the stock and sold into any rallies.
Today the OEM news hit. Notice that Sirius had been heading south in advance of the oem data.
Once it became clear that the numbers were not as bad as people had thought, the expected selloff never occurred, and those that had shorted the stock needed to cover. The MM's helped, specifically IGES, by maintaining a tight range so those positions could be closed.No real customer orders were executed this afternoon.
PS. The only people making money with SIRI stock is the MM's.
