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Thread: DGL and GOLD

  1. #41
    Havakasha is offline
    As a matter of fact he is calling for new housing bubble based on the low interest rates that the Fed is keeping in place.He is also calling for a massive collapse of the worlds economies, including hyperinflation and gold going to $12,000. He has been doing this kind of false predicting since at least 1998.

    I havent yet seen you own up to the fact that Mr. Schiff has been wildly wrong in the overwhelming majority of his predictions.When you do it we will ALL know you have some integrity. You will not get off easy. Not after having to chase you for 2 years on the subject. You have praised him repeatedly. Even calling his prediction that Gold will rise to $12,000 or the Dow will fall to 1,400 in the next 2 years "BOLD". Sorry but that aint bold its CLEARLY CRAZY LYING TALK. I understand its a little embarassing for you to have held this guy up as someone whose books you read and admire but you made a huge mistake propping him up as an esteemed "economist". You are clearly unable to acknowledge this so you grasp at straws at the one prediction he got "right.

    As far as what you want me to do. I have said repeatedly that he got his prediction of a housing bubble correct. Much like Paul Krugman and a host of other people did. I have also said that MR. Schiff had been predicting this same thing for a number of years where it didnt happen. When someone is wrong 19 out of 20 years I dont think he deserves the praise you want me to give
    him. You need to own up to his awful record of false predictions. YOU HAVE NOT DONE SO YET
    NO MATTER HOW MUCH YOU PRETEND YOU HAVE. ITS NOT ABOUT ONE OR TWO ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS, ITS ABOUT ADMITTING TO HIS PATTERN OF GETTING MOST THINGS WRONG.

    Have you admitted ever that Krugman got his prediction of the housing bubble correct? As a matter of fact i remember you challenging that fact. Here is your chance to show that you do indeed own up to facts.
    Last edited by Havakasha; 05-17-2012 at 11:47 AM.

  2. #42
    Havakasha is offline
    I have been waiting 2 years or so for you to respond to facts like these. You have zero integrity obviously.



    "In other words, Peter Schiff may be a classic case of a stopped clock: he's been predicting a market decline FOREVER and when the market has declined he's hailed as a genius by his cult fans."

    http://seekingalpha.com/article/1068...hiff-right-now

    Now, had you listened to Peter in 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006 or even 3/4 of 2007, you lost your shirt. Had you placed bets based on Schiff's market calls, you lost everything you wagered.

    The S&P (.INX) went from 1054 in May of 2002 (the date of the interview) to 1561 in Oct. 2007, a 48% gain and the Dow (.DJI) rose 40%.

    Banking stocks, the primary victim of the housing bust, went up (JP Morgan (JPM) 36%, Bank of America (BAC) 41%, Wells Fargo (WFC) 39% , Wachovia (WB) 31% and American Express (AXP) 51%) during that time frame (dividends excluded which would dramatically add to results).

    Bottom line? Had you listened to Mr. Schiff at anytime before Oct. 2007, you lost...big. To those who did, there is little consolation in the praise being heaped on him today.

    Milton Freidman said, "markets can stay dislocated longer than you can stay solvent." For those who bet with Schiff between 2002-2007, they know the statement well.

    Why is it a big deal? After all, Berkshire's (BRK.A) Warren Buffett claims he cannot time the market and often watches share prices decline in investments (like recent investments in Goldman Sachs (GS) and GE) before a rebound. How is this any different?

    For one, Warren's loss is limited to his investment. He buys 1 share of stock "a" at $25. $25 is the most he can lose.

    Now, if we listen to Peter and "short" stock "a" at 25, our loss has no limit. If it goes to $100, we lose $75. In shorting, we are only limited in our upside. If "a" goes to zero, "Schiffers" profit $25.

    Buffett's strategy is an investing one and Schiff's is a trading and timing one.

    Buffett followers can hold their shares, collect their dividend and wait for the rebound. Schiff followers collect no dividend and watched for over 5 years as their bet went wrong. How many stuck around? How many shorted into every market drop or "presumed" top over 5 years, only repeatedly losing money as the market kept rising and Schiff kept pounding his message home?

    Schiff should not be getting the praise he is getting today for being "so right" after saying the same thing and being "so wrong" for the previous 5 years.

  3. #43
    SiriuslyLong is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havakasha View Post
    As a matter of fact he is calling for new housing bubble based on the low interest rates that the Fed is keeping in place.He is also calling for a massive collapse of the worlds economies, including hyperinflation and gold going to $12,000. He has been doing this kind of false predicting since at least 1998.

    I havent yet seen you own up to the fact that Mr. Schiff has been wildly wrong in the overwhelming majority of his predictions.When you do it we will ALL know you have some integrity. You will not get off easy. Not after having to chase you for 2 years on the subject. You have praised him repeatedly. Even calling his prediction that Gold will rise to $12,000 or the Dow will fall to 1,400 in the next 2 years "BOLD". Sorry but that aint bold its CLEARLY CRAZY LYING TALK. I understand its a little embarassing for you to have held this guy up as someone whose books you read and admire but you made a huge mistake propping him up as an esteemed "economist". You are clearly unable to acknowledge this so you grasp at straws at the one prediction he got "right.

    As far as what you want me to do. I have said repeatedly that he got his prediction of a housing bubble correct. Much like Paul Krugman and a host of other people did. I have also said that MR. Schiff had been predicting this same thing for a number of years where it didnt happen. When someone is wrong 19 out of 20 years I dont think he deserves the praise you want me to give
    him. You need to own up to his awful record of false predictions. YOU HAVE NOT DONE SO YET
    NO MATTER HOW MUCH YOU PRETEND YOU HAVE. ITS NOT ABOUT ONE OR TWO ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS, ITS ABOUT ADMITTING TO HIS PATTERN OF GETTING MOST THINGS WRONG.

    Have you admitted ever that Krugman got his prediction of the housing bubble correct? As a matter of fact i remember you challenging that fact. Here is your chance to show that you do indeed own up to facts.
    So he's calling for another housing bubble? I hadn't read that anywhere.

    Still no comment on his first call on the housing bubble? YOU ARE PATHETIC. And candidly, I am pathetic for arguing with a such a loser that cannot comment on factual evidence due to his political position.

    I will repeat for the 10th time just to make sure. Schiff has been wrong on hyperinflation, a 1400 Dow and $12,000 gold, and you know what, I don't care. Really.

    Peter Schiff was right - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2I0QN-FYkpw

    What an interesting and accurate restrospective. To bad the extreme leftist can't see it that way.

  4. #44
    Havakasha is offline
    I am not talking just about his prediction of hyperinflation for 2011, a catastrophic stock market collapse for jan. of 2011, a prediction that 10 year treasury's would go to 6% hat in 2011, or his
    gold price predictions of $12,000. I AM talking about the FACT that he has made MANY similar
    WRONG predictions over the course of MANY years. That should have raised a red flag with you,
    enough so that you should have distanced yourself from him. There are many legitimate Conservative economists that you could follow and quote. The fact that you follow and praise him is just very telling. Sorry if you dont understand that.

    You should read more. For someone who didnt know who Milton Friedman was you sure seem to act like you know a lot about economics. Yes he said the low interest rates under Bernake were
    going to lead to a retread of what happened before. Do you get his newsletter or just read everything his says on his website. I know you read his books religiously.

    I already talked about his call on the housing bubble. Again you dont read very well. The insults always flow from you when you are feeling like you are on the wrong side of the facts. You need to stop acting like an out of control child.

    You give with one finger and take with one hand. That is why you post "peter schiff was right" and never post or acknowledge that has been wrong for the majority of the years he has been predictiing these things.


    Answer to these facts for once. You just cant do it unfortunately.
    Last edited by Havakasha; 05-17-2012 at 12:10 PM.

  5. #45
    Havakasha is offline
    Please tell me why its unfair to ask you to respond to the following article? Why is it impossible for you to answer to this article?


    "In other words, Peter Schiff may be a classic case of a stopped clock: he's been predicting a market decline FOREVER and when the market has declined he's hailed as a genius by his cult fans."

    http://seekingalpha.com/article/1068...hiff-right-now

    Now, had you listened to Peter in 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006 or even 3/4 of 2007, you lost your shirt. Had you placed bets based on Schiff's market calls, you lost everything you wagered.

    The S&P (.INX) went from 1054 in May of 2002 (the date of the interview) to 1561 in Oct. 2007, a 48% gain and the Dow (.DJI) rose 40%.

    Banking stocks, the primary victim of the housing bust, went up (JP Morgan (JPM) 36%, Bank of America (BAC) 41%, Wells Fargo (WFC) 39% , Wachovia (WB) 31% and American Express (AXP) 51%) during that time frame (dividends excluded which would dramatically add to results).

    Bottom line? Had you listened to Mr. Schiff at anytime before Oct. 2007, you lost...big. To those who did, there is little consolation in the praise being heaped on him today.

    Milton Freidman said, "markets can stay dislocated longer than you can stay solvent." For those who bet with Schiff between 2002-2007, they know the statement well.

    Why is it a big deal? After all, Berkshire's (BRK.A) Warren Buffett claims he cannot time the market and often watches share prices decline in investments (like recent investments in Goldman Sachs (GS) and GE) before a rebound. How is this any different?

    For one, Warren's loss is limited to his investment. He buys 1 share of stock "a" at $25. $25 is the most he can lose.

    Now, if we listen to Peter and "short" stock "a" at 25, our loss has no limit. If it goes to $100, we lose $75. In shorting, we are only limited in our upside. If "a" goes to zero, "Schiffers" profit $25.

    Buffett's strategy is an investing one and Schiff's is a trading and timing one.

    Buffett followers can hold their shares, collect their dividend and wait for the rebound. Schiff followers collect no dividend and watched for over 5 years as their bet went wrong. How many stuck around? How many shorted into every market drop or "presumed" top over 5 years, only repeatedly losing money as the market kept rising and Schiff kept pounding his message home?

    Schiff should not be getting the praise he is getting today for being "so right" after saying the same thing and being "so wrong" for the previous 5 years.

  6. #46
    SiriuslyLong is offline
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    Joined: Jan 2009 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 3,560
    Quote Originally Posted by Havakasha View Post
    You should read more. For someone who didnt know who Milton Friedman was you sure seem to act like you know a lot about economics. Yes he said the low interest rates under Bernake were
    going to lead to a retread of what happened before. Do you get his newsletter or just read everything his says on his website. I know you read his books religiously.

    I already talked about his call on the housing bubble. Again you dont read very well. The insults always flow from you when you are feeling like you are on the wrong side of the facts. You need to stop acting like an out of control child.

    You give with one finger and take with one hand. That is why you post "peter schiff was right" and never post or acknowledge that has been wrong for the majority of the years he has been predictiing these things.


    Answer to these facts for once. You just cant do it unfortunately.
    I read two books. The one I wish I had read in advance of the housing crash. That way I would have known about it IN ADVANCE of it happening. Wow.

    I already said I don't get his newsletter. In fact, the only time I go to his website is to post an article here that I know will solicit a leftist response from you.

    You have never "talked about his call" on the housing bubble. We've been doing this long enough. I don't believe you can show me.

    Insulting? It's actually necessary with someone as polarized and uncompromising as you. Sorry.

    Peter Schiff has been wrong on hyperinflation, a 1400 Dow and $12,000 gold. I don't post them as I've dismissed them. Get it? Wheat / Chaff? Ring a bell? Hyperbole? Ring a bell? Underlying basis? Ring a bell? Doubtful, doubtful and doubtful.

    There, I've done it... yet again.

    And by the way, the facts are irrefutable. Peter Schiff was right (on the housing bubble -- long in advance of the bubble bursting).

  7. #47
    SiriuslyLong is offline
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    Joined: Jan 2009 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 3,560
    And to post #45. We already had this discussioin months ago.

    You may recall that I noted part of Schiff's investment advice for American companies is that they pay a good dividend and sell in several geographic markets to diversify their sales to many markets and currencies. You may recall that companies like Coke, Catapillar and Yum Yum Brands were cited. I'm sure Buffet would agree with this as there is nothing controversial about it. I would pick one's with a low current multiple myself.

    You need to learn more about Schiff before you pass judgement that he is simply a doomsday predictor who has been doing the same thing for years.

    You may also recall that we discussed investing in gold and that it has been a very good investment long term. It has grown 6X since 2002. That's pretty damn good.

    Have you anything to say in response? Or are you just going to keep posting the article asking why I never addressed it (like some kind of lunatic)?

  8. #48
    Havakasha is offline
    The insults are simply a sign of a desperately caught individual. Caught praising an individual who should be dismissed for the many wrong calls he has made. One "right" call just doesnt cut it. My advice to you is to start reading a more respectable Conserivative who is actually an Economist (unlike Mr. Schiff).

    I have talked about the call on "housing" today as a a matter of fact so i sincerely dont know what you are talking about.

    Krugman was right on the housing bubble, Roubini was right on the housing bubble, Schiff was right on the housing bubble. Others were as well. The only difference between all three is that Mr. Schiff is not actually an economist and has been calling for economic and stock market collapses for many years before and is still calling for it. Get it? He has been wrong WAY TOO MANY TIMES TO TAKE HIM SERIOUSLY AS ANYTHING BUT A DOOM AND GLOOM NEWSLETTER PUMPER.

    You clearly want to hold onto to the few things he got "right" and ignore the overwhelming evidence of things he got WILDLY wrong. Sad.

    YOU MISS THE POINT ENTIRELY.
    I am not talking JUST about his prediction of hyperinflation for 2011, his prediction of a catastrophic stock market collapse for jan. of 2011, a prediction that 10 year treasury's would go to 6% hat in 2011, or his gold price predictions of $12,000. I AM talking about the FACT that he has made MANY WRONG predictions over the course of MANY years. That should have raised a red flag with you, enough so that you should have distanced yourself from him. There are many legitimate Conservative economists that you could follow and quote. The fact that you follow and praise him is just very telling. Sorry if you dont understand that.


    Its funny that you are COMPLETELY UNABLE to post a refutation of Mr. Schiff without saying but, but, but, but he was right about this one thing. And you give you it great weight. OVER and above the 100 he has gotten wrong. There is SIMPLY something really off about your desperate need to praise him.
    Last edited by Havakasha; 05-17-2012 at 12:47 PM.

  9. #49
    Havakasha is offline
    There is nothing "lunatic" about asking you to read and respond. Just another insult because you
    obviously are afraid to acknowledge it. I have researched Mr. Schiff thoroughly. I believe that
    research demonstrates that he is not someone to take seriously as an economic and stock market expert. Just because he has been right on gold doesnt make him a good financial advisor. I have pointed out repeatedly and you will see in this article that if you followed his financially advice over many years you would have lost a tremendous amount. If you cant honestly address that fact then i dont know what else to say to you except that your integrity is suspect.


    #45
    Havakasha
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
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    4,985
    Please tell me why its unfair to ask you to respond to the following article? Why is it impossible for you to answer to this article?


    "In other words, Peter Schiff may be a classic case of a stopped clock: he's been predicting a market decline FOREVER and when the market has declined he's hailed as a genius by his cult fans."

    http://seekingalpha.com/article/1068...hiff-right-now

    Now, had you listened to Peter in 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006 or even 3/4 of 2007, you lost your shirt. Had you placed bets based on Schiff's market calls, you lost everything you wagered.

    The S&P (.INX) went from 1054 in May of 2002 (the date of the interview) to 1561 in Oct. 2007, a 48% gain and the Dow (.DJI) rose 40%.

    Banking stocks, the primary victim of the housing bust, went up (JP Morgan (JPM) 36%, Bank of America (BAC) 41%, Wells Fargo (WFC) 39% , Wachovia (WB) 31% and American Express (AXP) 51%) during that time frame (dividends excluded which would dramatically add to results).

    Bottom line? Had you listened to Mr. Schiff at anytime before Oct. 2007, you lost...big. To those who did, there is little consolation in the praise being heaped on him today.

    Milton Freidman said, "markets can stay dislocated longer than you can stay solvent." For those who bet with Schiff between 2002-2007, they know the statement well.

    Why is it a big deal? After all, Berkshire's (BRK.A) Warren Buffett claims he cannot time the market and often watches share prices decline in investments (like recent investments in Goldman Sachs (GS) and GE) before a rebound. How is this any different?

    For one, Warren's loss is limited to his investment. He buys 1 share of stock "a" at $25. $25 is the most he can lose.

    Now, if we listen to Peter and "short" stock "a" at 25, our loss has no limit. If it goes to $100, we lose $75. In shorting, we are only limited in our upside. If "a" goes to zero, "Schiffers" profit $25.

    Buffett's strategy is an investing one and Schiff's is a trading and timing one.

    Buffett followers can hold their shares, collect their dividend and wait for the rebound. Schiff followers collect no dividend and watched for over 5 years as their bet went wrong. How many stuck around? How many shorted into every market drop or "presumed" top over 5 years, only repeatedly losing money as the market kept rising and Schiff kept pounding his message home?

    Schiff should not be getting the praise he is getting today for being "so right" after saying the same thing and being "so wrong" for the previous 5 years.
    Last edited by Havakasha; 05-17-2012 at 12:40 PM.

  10. #50
    SiriuslyLong is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havakasha View Post
    The insults are simply a sign of a desperately caught individual. Caught praising an individual who should be dismissed for the
    many wrong calls he has made. One "right" call just doesnt cut it. My advice to you is to start reading a more respectable Conserivative who is actually an Economist (unlike Mr. Schiff).

    I have talked about the call on "housing" today as a a matter of fact so i sincerely dont know what you are talking about.

    Krugman was right on the housing bubble, Roubini was right on the housing bubble, Schiff was right on the housing bubble.
    The only difference between all three is that Mr. Schiff had been calling for it many years before and is still calling for it.
    Get it?

    You dont get this obviously. Read it so you understand what i have been trying to get you to acknowledge for 2 years. I know
    you are not that thick.

    I am not talking just about his prediction of hyperinflation for 2011, a catastrophic stock market collapse for jan. of 2011, a prediction that 10 year treasury's would go to 6% hat in 2011, or his
    gold price predictions of $12,000. I AM talking about the FACT that he has made MANY similar
    WRONG predictions over the course of MANY years. That should have raised a red flag with you,
    enough so that you should have distanced yourself from him. There are many legitimate Conservative economists that you could follow and quote. The fact that you follow and praise him is just very telling. Sorry if you dont understand that.


    Its funny that you are COMPLETELY UNABLE to post a refutation of Mr. Schiff without saying but, but, but, but he was right about this one thing. And you give you it great weight. OVER and above the 100 he has gotten wrong. There is something really off
    about your desperate need to praise him.
    Well look there, "Schiff was right on the housing bubble", but then you go on to say that he'd been calling for several years so he's bound to be right sooner or later. WRONG. Please watch the video so you don't look so foolish. Some of his first words are "timing is immaterial". Jesus are you stupid. Yeah, Soros is making money on his gold investiment. You posted an article from 2011. Soros is losing money on gold dumbass. He bought high. You are so pathetically not credible. Are you remotely embarrassed about that?

    I think I've already responded to the rest of your garbage.

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