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  1. SiriuslyLong is offline
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    05-05-2010, 05:28 PM #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Havakasha View Post
    So i quess you oppose social security, medicare and medicaid? LOL.

    everytime you open your mouth you somehow spout another Republican talking points so i dont understand how you distanced yourself from the Republican Party.
    I loathe the religous right. Abortion to me is a non issue yet you still have these zealots standing there on a busy intersection with pictures of aborted fetuses. How do you explain that to your 8 year old daughter on the way to her soccer game??? How is that remotely good for anything? It's funny though. As soon as either party gets in the first executive orders are about things like that. I recall Obama overturned some stuff Bush did.

    Are you sirius? Social security, medicare, medicaid?? I oppose fraud, theft and mismanagement and I'm pretty sure some of that is going on with these "programs". And when we can't fund these programs any more - back to the original point - rioting, chaos (got it right this time, thanks for that), looting, death..... The entitled wil rise up just like what is happening now in Greece. The first domino. It's coming to a neighborhood near you.

  2. SiriuslyLong is offline
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    05-05-2010, 05:40 PM #12
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2I0QN-FYkpw

    BTW - Portugal is next. Got downgraded today. Nations need to produce (reference Peter Schiff- link). WTF do Portugal and Greece produce? Although, Portugal has been know for tooling.

  3. SiriuslyLong is offline
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  4. Havakasha is offline
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    05-05-2010, 05:48 PM #14
    Everyone opposes fraud, theft and mismanagement whether it takes place in govt or business.

    Do you oppose Social security, medicare and medicaid programs?

    You sound rather hyberolic in general. "The rioting, the death,...its coming to a neighborhood near you" I quess you better support the ending of the Bush tax cuts for the top !% then. lol.

  5. Havakasha is offline
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    05-05-2010, 05:57 PM #15
    Well i quess you got not choice but to short the stock market. Do it quick before the collapse of the world and 25% unemployment (now where did i hear that number before? hmmmm.). Only now you are sure its going to happen. LOL.

    Sounds a little wacky to me. I would love to see a real investigation of his track record and what he is invested in right now. Could he be heavy into gold? Hmmmm.

  6. SiriuslyLong is offline
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    05-05-2010, 07:15 PM #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Havakasha View Post
    Well i quess you got not choice but to short the stock market. Do it quick before the collapse of the world and 25% unemployment (now where did i hear that number before? hmmmm.). Only now you are sure its going to happen. LOL.

    Sounds a little wacky to me. I would love to see a real investigation of his track record and what he is invested in right now. Could he be heavy into gold? Hmmmm.
    Actually, there is a decent reason to short the stock market. I had dinner with a guy who used to work on Wall St who now invests in productive assets (i.e. companies that make something). His feeling is that there will be a reduction is overall demand for stocks as baby boomers begin to cash out of their plans.

    I know he sounds cooky, but I doubt he's a gold pumper (pending your definition of pumper). He runs The Trend Institute or something like that. Peter Schiff may be a gold pumper. But remember, there's a gold basher out there too - for every yin there's a yang, right?

    Do you have any gold in your portfolio? I have a stake in Fidelity Gold. It's a 3 star fund that invests primarily in Gold mining companies. I also took a position in a precious metals ETF and sold it for around a 10% gain. Held it a while. Up, down, up, down, but no major moves.

    In as much as I hate living in fear; the current world scenario does cause consternation. Buy your arms now!!! (Do I work for Remington lol?)

  7. SiriuslyLong is offline
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    05-05-2010, 07:22 PM #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Havakasha View Post
    Do you oppose Social security, medicare and medicaid programs?
    Not in principle, but "we" do need to get them to work correctly, and unfortunately, I don't believe the federal government can do it - too big. The federal government may very well be the biggest mark on the planet -- for a reason.

    I'll always remember a Nicholas Cage movie where he played a con man, "I don't take people's money, they give it to me".

  8. candleman is offline
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    05-06-2010, 10:00 AM #18
    I want to commend the two of you for keeping this converstation civil. It's such a nice turn around from the way that John discusses ideas.

    It's nice to know that people that don't agree on something, also don't need to degrade each other.

    I just wanted to say thanks and now go back at it boys.

    By the way. I don't like Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid for the simple reason of fraud. I know several people that have taken advantage of these three programs and it really irratates me.

    Each year I pay about 14 to 17 thousand dollars into the Social Security, Medicare system. This is just for myself. I pay another hundred or so thousand in for my employees.

    Personally, I will never see a return on my investment. I have private health insurance and hopefully, I'll be able to afford that till I die. I might get around 20 thousand a year in Social Security benefits, if it is still viable in 12 years when I think I might be able to retire. It's the fraud and waste in the system that makes the fee so high. I'd rather have private retirement and insurance plans to take care of me in my old age.

  9. SiriuslyLong is offline
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    05-06-2010, 03:55 PM #19
    Someone, somebody, something has to keep the first domino from falling. Although we've known about PIGS For a while know, it's only now really starting. I think they have a maturity this month. Can anyone confirm?

  10. john is offline
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    05-06-2010, 05:14 PM #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Havakasha View Post
    I beg to differ. Look it up. Even Hank Paulson the Secretary of the Treasury under Bush/Cheney has used that 25% figure.

    first fact. A large part of the deficit into the future is from the Bush administration.
    2nd fact. There is a difference between creating a deficit from a surplus which Bush did
    and using stimulus (which adds to the deficit) in order to help us get out of the 2nd worst recession in this country. Even Martin Feldstein the Conservative Republican economist argued that we needed large stimulus to help us out of the recession. He disagreed with the Obama formula for stimulus but not with the fact that we needed stimulus.
    No one is arguing that we dont have to deal with our large deficits once the economy is more stable and experiencing healthy growth, but cutting deficits in the middle of a recession is known to cause a depression.
    Yes, there are enormous problems in this country and the world now, but they didnt occur over the last year but developed over many years and wont be fixed for many years (some may never be solved because of the dysfunction of our political system) as well. Lets not be ignorant and try to act like all our problems are the fault of Obama. That is way more than absurd.

    P.S. Dick Cheney said "deficits dont matter". i am curious to hear you address a politician whose views you probably share a lot in common with.


    Here I am here for SiriuslyLong, since he cant seem to tell when the facts are only facts as Havasucker likes them to be shown (which is not true uncut way).


    His first fact does not mention that most of the money lent out (TARP) during the Bush time in, was paid back already and was then relent to other companies under Obama (as a matter of fact the TARP has become the Obamas slush fund and not used for it original purpose anymore.) SOOOOOO that means the biggest part of the Bush deficit was paid back.


    His second fact forgets to mention those surpluses were ESTIMATED and NOT ACTUAL. He also forgot that MOST of those Surpluses were BASED ON CAPITAL GAINS and corpate earnings and were wiped out after the tech bubble burst. Anything that was left was wiped out and put into a deficit by the 1.5 TRILLION the 911 terrorist attacks took out of the economy.


    As for the rest, noone is saying that there should have been no stimulas, it is how much was used and how much would have been needed if they were used the right way.


    As for Chaney and what he was talking about was incontext as to the GDP and not what you are talking about. Everyone now knows Obama and his liberial polocies are driving those deficits well beyond anything in history. Yes I know Havasucker likes to pluke a qoute totally out of context but it gets really bad when he does it to the extent that he could not even get the whole sentence and had to stop at 3 words. That is why I call him the twit he is. Hey Havasucker can you be honest for even one minute. I know when you are you know all your arguements fall apart but really man look at the level you have stupt to.
    Last edited by john; 05-06-2010 at 05:16 PM.

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