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Thread: Hybrid Car Market Forecast

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  1. #1
    lloyd Handwerker is offline
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    Hybrid Car Market Forecast

    http://www.theautochannel.com/news/2...26/467322.html

    One person posts a right wing think tank analysis with an obvious point of view
    Another posts an independent automotive information resource estimate.
    Who should you listen to?

    Obviously Hybrid purchases have slowed down. We are in the worst
    recession since the Great Depression. Car sales have slowed from 16 million to 9 million. The future is bright for hybrids, hybrid plug-ins, clean diesel, and electric cars no matter what those opposed to alternative energy technologies say. Follow the money trail and look at how much money investors are putting into these industries. Imagine where we will be 10 years from now.

  2. #2
    just sirius is offline
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    Lloyd

    First, I am not against alternative energy vehicles...As far as I'm concerned...build'em...just don't cram them down our throats! For all those who are clamoring for more hybrids, electric vehicles...they are really not much greener than fossil fuel vehicles. The batteries in 5-10 years are going to be a huge mess to dispose of! Guess we can send them to China and let them dump them out in the fields just like they do with computers!!

    But Lloyd, you brought up another interesting point that I have been trying to make. Let the free markets dictate if and when alternative energy vehicles are produced. You stated and i quote

    "Follow the money trail and look at how much money investors are putting into these industries. Imagine where we will be 10 years from now." You better be careful...John might mistake you for a capitalist! Sounds alot like a free market system to me!

    All of these technologies are coming to market without alot of help from the govt. That's the way it should be!
    PURCHASED THE CABIN IN THE WOODS...THANKS MEL, MALONE, AND THE BLUE DOG

  3. #3
    lloyd Handwerker is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by just sirius View Post
    Lloyd

    First, I am not against alternative energy vehicles...As far as I'm concerned...build'em...just don't cram them down our throats! For all those who are clamoring for more hybrids, electric vehicles...they are really not much greener than fossil fuel vehicles. The batteries in 5-10 years are going to be a huge mess to dispose of! Guess we can send them to China and let them dump them out in the fields just like they do with computers!!

    But Lloyd, you brought up another interesting point that I have been trying to make. Let the free markets dictate if and when alternative energy vehicles are produced. You stated and i quote

    "Follow the money trail and look at how much money investors are putting into these industries. Imagine where we will be 10 years from now." You better be careful...John might mistake you for a capitalist! Sounds alot like a free market system to me!

    All of these technologies are coming to market without alot of help from the govt. That's the way it should be!

    Oh, i know you are not against hybrids. As you know im talking about someone else. LOL. I am a capitalist sowhere did you get the idea i wasnt?
    Oh i get it your just confused enough to think that the subsidies and
    Govt help "we" support is Socialist while the subsidies and Govt help "you" support is Capitalist.
    But anyway i really dont understand this obsession with Govt cramming certain cars down your throat. As far as i can tell its a free country and you can buy any damn car you want. Now i happen to think cars should have gotten much better mileage over these last 10 years or so and i am grateful for the Govt pushing for higher mileage standards and supporting the new technologies like hybrids, hybrid plug-ins, etc. I notice that a certain segment of the society now clamoring about the Govt NEVER SAID NOTHING
    when the govt was supporting oil, gas, coal, and nuclear companies. So excuse me if some of the yelling rings mighty hollow.
    Maybe the batteries which will be good for 10 years or more and which are getting better and better all the time through new innovations will also be recycleable as well as the little batteries we use right now. You do recycle your AA, AAA, C, D batteries i hope.

    To say that hybrids are no greener than normal cars just aint true but you can believe what you want. i am done trying to convince some of you guys of some basic facts.
    Oh and by the way i love the free market system when it is TRULY free. For
    too many years its been stacked in favor of the well connected lobbyists and money people whose industries had the ability to screw things up for the rest of us. Thats why i think its ironic that the guy you mentioned is so unaware that the money is flowing quite naturally to alternative energy research and development, and as the research study i presented shows it
    should continue to grow.

  4. #4
    just sirius is offline
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    Lloyd,

    I know that the money is flowing into R&D for alternative energy vehicles, and most of it is coming from the private sector...the free market...it has always been the case...when price of oil goes up...SUV sales plummet! The people want SUV's...not roller skates...and yes, the govt is pushing hard to eliminate "gas guzzlers" threw cafe standards...so in affect...they are dictating what cars we buy! I absolutely have no problem with hybrids etc...I hope you just don't blindly believe that they are that much cleaner than fossil fuel vehicles...Until the battery problem is solved...and at this time...it is not...when they are disposed of...they are considered toxic waste, BTW motor oil can and is recycled! My question to you is...since Toyota, Honda, Ford, GM, Tesla, Nissan, and others are pushing to be the first and the best in alternative energy technology...why do we need govt intervention?

    BTW- don't believe what you read about the Chevy Volt...No way that they can get 230+ MPG Also, they state that it will cost about .40 cents a day to charge the volt...again, no way...they used .05 cents per KW/hr Probably 4-5 times that...actual cost will be, depending on your part of the country...
    .15-.20 per KW/hr so about 1.60-2.00 per day... still cheap though! My best guess...if it goes only 40 miles per charge at this time...equalivent of 50mpg when compared to vehicle getting 20mpg and gas at 2.50/gal.
    PURCHASED THE CABIN IN THE WOODS...THANKS MEL, MALONE, AND THE BLUE DOG

  5. #5
    lloyd Handwerker is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by just sirius View Post
    Lloyd,

    I know that the money is flowing into R&D for alternative energy vehicles, and most of it is coming from the private sector...the free market...it has always been the case...when price of oil goes up...SUV sales plummet! The people want SUV's...not roller skates...and yes, the govt is pushing hard to eliminate "gas guzzlers" threw cafe standards...so in affect...they are dictating what cars we buy! I absolutely have no problem with hybrids etc...I hope you just don't blindly believe that they are that much cleaner than fossil fuel vehicles...Until the battery problem is solved...and at this time...it is not...when they are disposed of...they are considered toxic waste, BTW motor oil can and is recycled! My question to you is...since Toyota, Honda, Ford, GM, Tesla, Nissan, and others are pushing to be the first and the best in alternative energy technology...why do we need govt intervention?

    BTW- don't believe what you read about the Chevy Volt...No way that they can get 230+ MPG Also, they state that it will cost about .40 cents a day to charge the volt...again, no way...they used .05 cents per KW/hr Probably 4-5 times that...actual cost will be, depending on your part of the country...
    .15-.20 per KW/hr so about 1.60-2.00 per day... still cheap though! My best guess...if it goes only 40 miles per charge at this time...equalivent of 50mpg when compared to vehicle getting 20mpg and gas at 2.50/gal.
    As i have repeated many times the Govt HAS ALWAYS intervened in industry you just seem to refuse to acknowledge it. The nuclear industry fails without huge govt support. Its just way to expensive. And i could go on and on. In this case govt is intervening to bring us more energy efficient and cleaner cars. Just like they intervene to set standards on more energy efficient refrigerators, air conditioners etc. etc. etc. I dont here anyone get up in arms about that. Nor should they. its just good policy. American car companies had to be dragged kicking and screaming into increasing their mileage standards arguing all along the way that they couldnt possibly meet those standards. And you know what they ultimately did every time. They needed to have their feet held to the fire. We need a balance of govt and private industry. its always been that and it always been that. One alone without the other will lead to catastrophe as it did with unregulated derivatives (wall st.)

    I was always completely confident as far back as 10 years that the car industry would develop exactly as it has. The only problem was that it should have happened long ago. Sometimes we need Govt (which afterall is made up of people that the citizens elected and which is supposed to represent us) to help set policies in this country. Do you like Social Security and Medicare and the military health care system etc?i know it often doesnt unfortunately because big money of the private sector has undue influence)

    I have never been a big fan of the Volt by the way. It has to come way down in cost and its more of a publicity gimmick for GM than a money maker. Of course they are exaggerating the mileage. I am still glad they are making them however because its a path on the road to where we will ultimately get. We will have hybrids, hybrid in plug ins, electrics, clean diesels, and you or your children will be driving them very happily and never even thinking that the dastardly govt has forced us to do anything. You really need to chill a little bit on this subject. Leave the stubborness to that other guy.
    The new car industry will be a positive example of how govt and private industry can work together and produce good results. Take a look at the Spanish high speed rail system. Its an amazing example of private enterprise working with govt to produce an new industry from scratch for Spain in as little as 20 years.
    Take my word i am not blindly believing something. i have thought about and read about this subject for many years. I have produced neutral studies that demonstrate what i believe. You decide. Have a good day.

  6. #6
    lloyd Handwerker is offline
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    I was rushing to get out of the house so sorry for some of the grammatical
    and other kinds of mistakes in my last post. It was more of stream of consciousness.
    The battery discussion is a good one to have and i would love to get it into that soon. The 5 year figure is way outmoded so watch out when you listen to the other guy. Do your own research.
    I was just curious as to what happens to the batteries in gas run cars right now?
    What i do know is that hybrids, hybrid plug-ins, clean diesels and electrics all contribute to a much cleaner environment and help to lower dramatically our dependence on Middle East oil as well. Its a win/win for the U.S.

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