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Thread: Ev's "major portion" of Ford lineup in 10-12 years

  1. #11
    lloyd Handwerker is offline
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    That should have read you got to be a little LESS "ONESIDED".
    Funny either way.

  2. #12
    just sirius is online now
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    Lloyd

    got to give credit when credit is due! You are damn good at twisting the facts...yes Republicans had majority control of house and senate...however...you conviently left off the part that they didnot have complete control of either the house or senate. Every bill passed by Bush...absolutely had to have Dem support...every single one! Obama has pledged...no guarenteed...that our deficit will be multiple times higher in the first year than all of Bush's combined! With your complete control of all three branches of govt...you will not need a single Republican vote to pass your agenda...thus...CRAM IT DOWN OUR THROAT!

    Have you checked the polls lately. Four different polls showed that 60%+ of american people do not want...I repeat...do not want govt involved with healthcare...period...Energy...people have spoken there as well...70%+ wanted to "Drill...Baby...Drill" Obama caved during the election(lied) during the election...absolutely...has no intention of allowing anymore drilling...period

    The Auto industry is BK due to putting out inferior products for years...giving away the farm...being bullied by UAW bosses. 90% pay when layed off...sign me up...I'll sit home for 90%...hell...I won't even answer my phone when you call me back to work...Legacy costs, greed, stupidity killed the auto industry.
    I have a simple solution...move all production to right to work states like Texas...pay them a fair wage...produce superior/equalivalent product...fire them when they FU...I guarantee you that they will be profitable...no doubt about it!

    BTW- you conviently did not respond to financial meltdown...alternative energy building strong base for 30+ years without much govt assistance...or tax and kill...

  3. #13
    lloyd Handwerker is offline
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    I believe you are incorrect about what happened during the first 6 years of the Bush administration. I believe George Bush NEVER vetoed even one bill.
    That means Bush and the Republican majority wanted everything that was\
    passed.
    When Democrats took over control of the house Bush first used his veto power. I believe that Bush's veto was overturned only once or twice during his entire administration Am i notcorrect?

    Even some Conservative Republicans have owned up to the fact that they let the defecit run wild out of control. I dont know why YOU wouldnt accept their mea culpa.

    The stimulus bill was passed with 3 Republican Senators support (snow,
    collins and Specter) it wouldnt have passed without them. It depends
    on whether or not fillibuster power or 60 votes is needed or a simple majority or 60
    It was the same when Republicans under Bush had majority control of both
    Houses of Congress. I am confused by what you are trying to say.

    Many economists would argue that when you have a very serious recession and are close to a Depression that it is essential to spend money.
    If not they would argue the economy would completely collapse. Even Warren Buffett supports a second stimulus package. You obviously disagree.

    I quess we have read different polls. I will have to do some research when
    I have some time because i read some polls that showed a large majority supported some public health component. I quess we will have to produce
    our polls.

    isnt there lots of land that the Oil companies can drill on right now?
    I read they arent drilling on much of it because it isnt profitable at the moment. i personally want us to be less reliant on oil. Not interested in
    keeping us dependent on Mideast oil or even domestic oil. I think its absolutely essential that we move toward alternaive energy system for lots of reasons. Obviously you disagree.

    I did respond to 30 years alternative energy base. You need to read 2 posts
    ago. Just to repeat. Alternative energy has been up against well entrenched and well subsidized oil, gas, coal an Nuclear. The alternative energy business practically died after having a strong push in the 70's and
    early 80's. It has come back out of necessity but also becaise pf strong Govt support. i dont think you can have one without the other. When they
    work hand in hand they work well. Lot of countries around the world are
    passing us by in terms of infrastructure spending (high speed trains etc)
    and alternative energy production. if you think that isnt a serious matter i believe you are mistaken. Not quite sure why you seem to "hate"anything that involves Govt. I think you probably rely on it more than you realize.

    I'm sorry but i just disagree about your analysis of the financial meltdown.
    Criminal intent was allowed to develop and flourish because there was lax regulation and hardly any oversight. It was partly a philosophical choice to
    keep the reins loose and i believe that helped to create the disaster. An unfettered free market will tempt certain types to go over the line.We see it all the time in China with product and food safety. A certain amount of regulation is important.The pendulum swings back and forth and all we can do is to try to find the right balance.

    The American Auto industry certainly did make inferior products for many years. The leadership of the auto industry and the unions bear responsibility. Cant blame it all on the workers. Sounds a little like you want to blame it only on unions and workers.

  4. #14
    just sirius is online now
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    1. you are correct...everything Republicans wanted passed. could not have passed without dem support...could not have passed...Republications never had complete control of both house and senate.

    2. You are correct...Republicans did go on spending spree...with major help from the dems. No doubt about...However...somehow...you have me mistakenly labeled a republican. I am a moderate conservative! So...since the Republicans spent waaaay too much cash...its OK for Obama and the dem house/senate to spend 3-4 times as much!

    3. The three senators that voted for the stimulus bill...spector...now dem...other 2 Republican in name only!

    4. It is impossible to spend your way out of a recession! Has never been done...Ask Japan how well 7 stimulus plans have worked for them!

    5. Agreed polls are different...agree to disagree!

    6. Agreed...want us to move away from dependence on oil...However...that is 50years in the future...why are we paying for the King of Saudi Arabia to maintain his fortunes. Could be putting hundreds of thousands of americans to work drilling here...increases jobs...decreases dependence on others...as long as we are dependent on foreign oil...progress will be slowed down. We have the ability to produce oil here in 180 days...get our economy moving forward while at the same time putting the screws to the Middle East. BTW line of BS about "dont they already have land that they can drill in"...there technology shows them where most oil is likely to be found. I guess it is OK for Obama to publically lie to the people...

    7. Alternative energy has been growing by leaps and bounds since the 90's...I read what you posted...you obviously did not read mine...Toyota/Honda developed hybrid technology without significant govt assistance...wind energy...again developed without significant govt assistance...instead of spending billions on wifi...why not spend money on infrastructure for transmission lines so wind energy can get into the grid...solar...technology 10 times better than just 10 years ago...all of these are great technoolgic advances...all made without significant govt involvment. Leave the markets alone...they are producing great products without govt intervention. Not needed. Bullet trains...love the idea...but probably too late in this country...what are you going to do...use imminent domain to take away private citizens property...

    8. 2 words...medicare/social security

    9. There is regulations in place...just ignored...still to this day...ignored I dont see Obamas SEC chairwoman doing anything about all the bs in the market...Without the pressure of Senator kaufman(D) nothing would be happening...Kaufaman is Bidens replacement...why the hell didn't biden speak up like his replacement has. Kaufamn is one Dem that I could possible support...just dont know the rest of his background
    Since you state market collapse is all Republicans fault...how about Frank/Dodd fiasco...Clinton...Obama are just as guilty...the Repuplicans had nothing to do with changing lending requirements...ya some of them may had voted for it...but as you said...Clinton did not veto it...so its all on him!

    10. again re-read my post...never put 1 ounce of blame on workers...Union bosses(greed) GM management(stupidity) legacy costs destroyed US Auto. Since you brought up unions...if they would only practice whats good for the company as a whole( equal to the sum of its parts) unions would not have such a bad rap...A company should have the right to fire any employee performing at a substandard level, or puts his fellow workers in danger etc...Union will 100% back the employee...even when he/she is dead wrong. Another example...My wife works for the public utility in San Antonio...Due to unstable economy...no merit raises for all non-union employees...however, all union workers get automatic 2.75% raise...whether they suck or not...if they suck...cannot be fired!

    We agree on quite a few things...I would just like to know how the low income family trying to raise a family will be able to pay for all of the checks that Obamas ass cant cash!
    Last edited by just sirius; 07-10-2009 at 02:06 AM.

  5. #15
    lloyd Handwerker is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by just sirius View Post
    1. you are correct...everything Republicans wanted passed. could not have passed without dem support...could not have passed...Republications never had complete control of both house and senate.

    2. You are correct...Republicans did go on spending spree...with major help from the dems. No doubt about...However...somehow...you have me mistakenly labeled a republican. I am a moderate conservative! So...since the Republicans spent waaaay too much cash...its OK for Obama and the dem house/senate to spend 3-4 times as much!

    3. The three senators that voted for the stimulus bill...spector...now dem...other 2 Republican in name only!

    4. It is impossible to spend your way out of a recession! Has never been done...Ask Japan how well 7 stimulus plans have worked for them!

    5. Agreed polls are different...agree to disagree!

    6. Agreed...want us to move away from dependence on oil...However...that is 50years in the future...why are we paying for the King of Saudi Arabia to maintain his fortunes. Could be putting hundreds of thousands of americans to work drilling here...increases jobs...decreases dependence on others...as long as we are dependent on foreign oil...progress will be slowed down. We have the ability to produce oil here in 180 days...get our economy moving forward while at the same time putting the screws to the Middle East. BTW line of BS about "dont they already have land that they can drill in"...there technology shows them where most oil is likely to be found. I guess it is OK for Obama to publically lie to the people...

    7. Alternative energy has been growing by leaps and bounds since the 90's...I read what you posted...you obviously did not read mine...Toyota/Honda developed hybrid technology without significant govt assistance...wind energy...again developed without significant govt assistance...instead of spending billions on wifi...why not spend money on infrastructure for transmission lines so wind energy can get into the grid...solar...technology 10 times better than just 10 years ago...all of these are great technoolgic advances...all made without significant govt involvment. Leave the markets alone...they are producing great products without govt intervention. Not needed. Bullet trains...love the idea...but probably too late in this country...what are you going to do...use imminent domain to take away private citizens property...

    8. 2 words...medicare/social security

    9. There is regulations in place...just ignored...still to this day...ignored I dont see Obamas SEC chairwoman doing anything about all the bs in the market...Without the pressure of Senator kaufman(D) nothing would be happening...Kaufaman is Bidens replacement...why the hell didn't biden speak up like his replacement has. Kaufamn is one Dem that I could possible support...just dont know the rest of his background
    Since you state market collapse is all Republicans fault...how about Frank/Dodd fiasco...Clinton...Obama are just as guilty...the Repuplicans had nothing to do with changing lending requirements...ya some of them may had voted for it...but as you said...Clinton did not veto it...so its all on him!

    10. again re-read my post...never put 1 ounce of blame on workers...Union bosses(greed) GM management(stupidity) legacy costs destroyed US Auto. Since you brought up unions...if they would only practice whats good for the company as a whole( equal to the sum of its parts) unions would not have such a bad rap...A company should have the right to fire any employee performing at a substandard level, or puts his fellow workers in danger etc...Union will 100% back the employee...even when he/she is dead wrong. Another example...My wife works for the public utility in San Antonio...Due to unstable economy...no merit raises for all non-union employees...however, all union workers get automatic 2.75% raise...whether they suck or not...if they suck...cannot be fired!

    We agree on quite a few things...I would just like to know how the low income family trying to raise a family will be able to pay for all of the checks that Obamas ass cant cash!

    I wrote a long response to all your points and then forgot to submit reply.
    i think its gone. Oh well. have to do it again another time. Too busy today
    to deal with it. Have a good day.

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